Need Help with Stereo Upgrade advice

[Bradly]

The Crownline currently has

4 Sony 6.5" Coaxial Speakers (140 Watt Max, 35 RMS)
A Pioneer Premeir DEH-7600 MP3 CD Player (suppose to be 50 Watts x 4)

I really like the sound effect EQ built into the head unit, and the MP3 Feature so I would like to keep it.

What I am lacking is any sort of bass or clarity over 1/3 volume. It all blows up into a garbled mess. I have Very Very limited storage in this boat as it is, so the idea of adding a lot of speaker boxes turns me off.

I want to add a some sort of sub(s) to the system to get the low end feel and volume. I also want to amplify the Coaxials to get the clarity.

A couple of questions, first, are 8" subs worth installing? I have measured and I don't think I have room for a 10" in the space under the bow cushions. I thought that this would be an ideal place for them, using the storage area under the two front seats for the box, and the speaker grill basically being at my feet in the vertical wall, completely in the open. I assumed this would be the best place for clarity and volume. I may be able to squeeze 10"s in the space if I use a 1" spacer to bring the speaker out away from the flush vertical surface there. Any body have a source for something that won't look gay, and won't rot?

The second option for the subs would be to mount them under the rear bench seat (I was going to look at a set mounted this way Sunday, but the emminent monsoon took precident). What type of boxes would be used in this application? Would I vent them through the seat base into the cabin?

The third option would be some sort of box under the sunpad, using up valuable blender and auxillary cooler storage space. If I was to do this, would I need a pair of boxes (one for each side of the engine) to keep the system sounding even, or would a single fill up the space?

Now to amplifying the mids. I was thinking it might be a good idea to leave 1 set of mids on the head unit amplifier, so I could still listen to the stereo without having the amplifiers turned on. Is this a common practice, or is it an all or nothing sort of deal? 35 watts RMS seems a bit on the wimpy side, when most amplifiers I am looking at are minimum of 100 watts x 4 channels. Or am I getting confused and the rating on the amplifier is the Max output rating as well.

I looked at Polk Momos, and don't like the open grates. I am not mud wrestling in the boat, but I can see crap getting through those.... Does any one have any other experience with lets say a $75-$100 per pair Coaxial that comes with white grills?

Would I damage speakers or amplifiers if I ran the coax's in parallel to split the output between 2 speakers?

Well this post is long enough, thanks in advance for your replies.

[bghert]

What model is your Crownline. I had a 2000 248 that I put 5 pairs of coaxials in and two 10" subs all amplified and it sounded great, but it is all about what you want as an end result. I had the U-shaped rear bench and mounted a subwoofer on either side under the bench in sealed downfiring boxes. I mounted the amps under the dash area. As far as marine speakers go I am not sure what the best sound is but I know MB Quart makes a 6.5 marine with a full white grill and based on the name should sound very good. You could keep the Sony's (you would be surprised how much better they will sound amplified) in thier place, add a four channel amp and a sub and it will rock pretty good.

[AMER3]

call i can help. here pic of my boat .http://www.mraudio.com/ jc

[bsloop]

00Crowline,

Are you looking to have an enhanced experenced
1) hanging out in the boat?
2) While running and doing water sports?
3) entertaining the whole cove?

Boat model would be helpful too.

I am going to assume you are looking for somewhere between 1 and 2.
Not sure how much you are looking to spend but numbers add up quick.

You have a good head unit that should allow you some flexibility in your up grades. Your little 6.5's do not like to reproduce the lows so you are on the right track with the subs.

The head unit has a separate pre-out for subs and internal Hi / Lo pass crossover points. This will allow you to take those low frequencies off the 6.5's which will dramatically increase the sound quality and volume without any upgrades. You can turn on the high pass this weekend and run a little test to see if it cleans things up enough and gives you the highs you want.

If not, check out a little company called Wet Sounds. They overbuild everything to take the marine environment and understand the "alcohol effect" I have a pair of their 485 tower speakers but I am sure their new 6.5 coax will rock as well. Jarrod at South Austin Marine 512-892-2432 may hook you up. You should be able to get 10% off the $199/pair list and free shipping if you ask.
Any speaker upgrades and you are into an amp.

Without a better under standing of boat model it is hard to say how much room you have for subs. At your feet in the cockpit is common placement for wakeboard boats. The sound is omni directional so you can place them anywhere and they do not have to be equally placed. It will be a little louder if the woffer cone can fire into the open. Stuffing a sub box into an enclosed rear compartment will reduce the over all effect. You will still feel the low but they may loose a little punch. If you do opt for the rear, check out Bazooka's marine sub, they have done all the work, just mount. They are not the absolute hardest hitting in high volume applications but sound good. My experience says go with an external amp. I had an Alpine PLT internal amped sub and toasted the amp, everything was so tied together the whole unit is no good.

Put any amps in the driest part of the boat. As for amps, there is a big fan base here for the Alpine PDX. I run Rockford Fosgate's Power series (not the Punch you find in Best Buy, etc) One of my clients is in the car audio replacement business, RF hands down, especially in sub applications.

When adding subs, an isolated second battery is a must! I highly reccomend an automatic combiner such as this http://www.yandina.com/c100Info.htm over a Perko switch. If you go with a manual 1/2/all combiner please UNDERSTAND HOW TO USE IT. It has been hashed over here before and I see it all the time with people on the water that have no clue.

Good luck and enjoy the new tunes!! [smilie=trink39]

[Christian]

Brian, do they make a combiner that can handle larger alternators, or jsut up to the 150amp models? I coudl not find a larger on the website

Thanks

[bsloop]

All I have seen are the two on their website.

According to the specs it is is good for alternators rated up to 250amps!!! and rated for 150 continuous. As you prob know most alternators are rated at peak efficiency which is cool and ideal speed.
Within a few minutes most alts fall off considerably from their rating due to heat alone from what I understand.

I know you are pushing some considerable power but didnt know your alt was that big.
Give them a call.

[Christian]

All I have seen are the two on their website.

According to the specs it is is good for alternators rated up to 250amps!!! and rated for 150 continuous. As you prob know most alternators are rated at peak efficiency which is cool and ideal speed.
Within a few minutes most alts fall off considerably from their rating due to heat alone from what I understand.

I know you are pushing some considerable power but didnt know your alt was that big.
Give them a call.

Since I am shy on batteries (only 4 dedicated to the stereo, and have 2 more dedicated to the fridge, microwave etc) I figured I would go old school and got them re-wound to 175 amps at 3800 rpm and 110 amps at 1500-1800 rpms

I figured better safe than sorry :mrgreen: they draw a bit of power from the motor when they are charging :oops:

3 Rockford Power series old school 800 watt RMS amps birth sheet at 1400ish

[bghert]

Since I am shy on batteries (only 4 dedicated to the stereo, and have 2 more dedicated to the fridge, microwave etc) I figured I would go old school and got them re-wound to 175 amps at 3800 rpm and 110 amps at 1500-1800 rpms

I figured better safe than sorry :mrgreen: they draw a bit of power from the motor when they are charging :oops:

3 Rockford Power series old school 800 watt RMS amps birth sheet at 1400ish

Where did you go to get the alternators upgraded? I definitely need to beef my output up a bit.

[Christian]

Any local starter / alternator shop should be able to accomodate you I just took mine to a local place and tld them what I needed and they took care of me

[injun]

put a four channel amp on the 4 Sony 6.5" Coaxial Speakers and put a sub under your back seat.. it will work

[Bradly]

Boat is just a baby 180 Bowrider. Thanks for all the replies so far, I am progressing in my understanding in all of this, and narrowing my selections a bit.

I am still fuzzy on the ratings of the speakers vs Amps.

If my 6.5's are rated at 140 watts max, 35 RMS and I connect them to a 4x100 watt amp, will that be ok?

Then there is option 2 a 4x250 amp with 2 channels being used to run two subs, and the other 2 channels being connected to 4 6.5's. Can this be done? Or would it be better to use 2 separate amps, one for the subs and 1 for the coax's since I have two sets of preouts, and then basically I can use the high low pass filter on each amp (or preout) to match what the amp is powering.

[BINGO]

Git rid of the Sony's. Upgrade to fusion, infinity, or may be pioneer. Do put the "high pass" on your deck to run the 6.5's. One sub would be plenty if you are just looking fill in the base and add some punch. Do you have room for a 10" or 12" small sub box somewhere? The Pioneer deck is not a true 50 watts rms to each channel. I do like the deck and have a Pioneer deck my self. My suggestions.

1. New brand of 6.5 speaker that can handle more power.
2. 2 amps, one 4 channel to run the 6.5's on high pass and 1 for the sub.

My 2 cents only.

[bsloop]

Since I am shy on batteries (only 4 dedicated to the stereo, and have 2 more dedicated to the fridge, microwave etc) I figured I would go old school and got them re-wound to 175 amps at 3800 rpm and 110 amps at 1500-1800 rpms

I figured better safe than sorry :mrgreen: they draw a bit of power from the motor when they are charging :oops:

3 Rockford Power series old school 800 watt RMS amps birth sheet at 1400ish

DANG!! I knew you were a little above the norm.
If Yandina cant help you maybe KP&L can. They specialize in powering small cities. [smilie=wow.gif] [smilie=wowguy.gif]
Seriously, you sound good. Those older RF are solid but do like the juice especially pushing those subs.